[TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

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semtexxl
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:49 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by semtexxl » Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:10 pm

Hi,

I'm having some very interesting problem in regards with sample rate adjustment by neutron on output. I'm using Galaxy S9+ with my Sennheiser HD598Cs. I've been using it for the very long time on android pie with latest firmware updates (currently August update). It was working just perfect before the last update of Neutron. I didn't change any settings prior the problem. Neutron was perfectly able to play Hi-Res audio with 24/96 sample rate with correct output showed even by neutron. Same with redbook files 16/44.1KHz. Even DSD was played as 24 bit with 88.2KHz on output! Just perfect. Switching to native DSD caused only static noise which is again correct because it is only capable playing DSD by DoP not natively. Output was automatically set accordingly to input sample rate and bit depth.

I'm using following setting:

Generic Driver: ON - RAW Mode with 32-bit Int and 44.1/48/88.2/96/176.4/192 sample rates checked
Hi-Res Codec (Direct PCM): ON
Low Latency: OFF
Oversampling:OFF
Follow Source Frequncy:ON

Now it is completelly different sample rates than on input: redbook 16/44.1 shows 48KHz, Higher-Res 24/96 show 48KHz again. The only output that switches automatically is 192Khz. Is this a bug? I'm 100% positive it was working perfectly as described above. Actually it was the only player correctly adjusting output samplerate. Now I'm back to zero. Is there anyone with S9+ facing the same problems? It may be the latest Neutron update or the latest Android update. Is there any workaround? BTW Outputting all tracks to DSD is causing totall freeze of the android device. The only solution is restart....Thanks in advance for your help!

blaubär
Posts: 403
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by blaubär » Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:38 pm

semtexxl wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:10 pm
Now it is completelly different sample rates than on input: redbook 16/44.1 shows 48KHz, Higher-Res 24/96 show 48KHz again. The only output that switches automatically is 192Khz. Is this a bug? I'm 100% positive it was working perfectly as described above. Actually it was the only player correctly adjusting output samplerate. Now I'm back to zero. Is there anyone with S9+ facing the same problems? It may be the latest Neutron update or the latest Android update. Is there any workaround? BTW Outputting all tracks to DSD is causing totall freeze of the android device. The only solution is restart....Thanks in advance for your help!
If you set everything to default, especially disable follow-source-frequency : what sample rates are available ?
And can you use them with 44.1 kHz and 96 kHz input ? Can you e.g. upsample 96 kHz input to 192 kHz output ?

semtexxl
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:49 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by semtexxl » Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:12 pm

blaubär wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 1:38 pm
If you set everything to default, especially disable follow-source-frequency : what sample rates are available ?
And can you use them with 44.1 kHz and 96 kHz input ? Can you e.g. upsample 96 kHz input to 192 kHz output ?
Thanks many times for the swift reply. When I switch everything back to defaut it disables follow-source frequency automatically. Then I can switch from two available sample rates 48 and 192KHz. Yes, I'm able upsample 96KHz input to 192KHz or downsample to 48KHz if I want. Again, switchng back to follow sample frequency and custom format degrades original 96 to 48KHz. As I said earlier the only two formats that are set automatically are 48 and 192KHz, everything else is degraded and downsampled. This kind of behaviour is unecceptable for me. I don't want my audio to be played on any different sample rate from original one like previously. Why would anyone crippled the device audio ability with any update? I just don't get it. This last update made Neutron obsolete for me. Or maybe I don't have any other chance to get bitperfect playback :?

blaubär
Posts: 403
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by blaubär » Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:26 am

semtexxl wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 8:12 pm
Then I can switch from two available sample rates 48 and 192KHz. Yes, I'm able upsample 96KHz input to 192KHz or downsample to 48KHz if I want. Again, switchng back to follow sample frequency and custom format degrades original 96 to 48KHz. As I said earlier the only two formats that are set automatically are 48 and 192KHz, everything else is degraded and downsampled. This kind of behaviour is unecceptable for me. I don't want my audio to be played on any different sample rate from original one like previously. Why would anyone crippled the device audio ability with any update? I just don't get it. This last update made Neutron obsolete for me. Or maybe I don't have any other chance to get bitperfect playback :?
If you want to make sure that it's the new Neutron version then write to the developer at neutronmp@gmail.com, he can provide a link to the old version, you can then reinstall and try that out.
I don't think it's the neutron version - Neutron checks what sample rates are available on the device. If you are sure that this check doesn't get the correct results, you could use Audio Format > Generic Driver > Custom Format to overwrite it. But that says "Expert Use Only!" .
Besides, changing the sampling rate isn't "crippling". There are users who voluntarily upsample or oversample because they think this enhances the quality.
( Personally I don't hear any difference between high-res and not-high-res, am content with 320 kb/s mp3, and use affordable AKG K702 headphones. I'd be interested to know what equipment you use - if you want "bitperfect" you surely have disabled all dsp effects, equalizers etc - what sound transducers do you use ? And do you hear a difference, let's say between upsampled and not upsampled ? )

semtexxl
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:49 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by semtexxl » Fri Sep 06, 2019 6:46 am

blaubär wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:26 am
If you want to make sure that it's the new Neutron version then write to the developer at neutronmp@gmail.com, he can provide a link to the old version, you can then reinstall and try that out.
I don't think it's the neutron version - Neutron checks what sample rates are available on the device. If you are sure that this check doesn't get the correct results, you could use Audio Format > Generic Driver > Custom Format to overwrite it. But that says "Expert Use Only!" .
Besides, changing the sampling rate isn't "crippling". There are users who voluntarily upsample or oversample because they think this enhances the quality.
( Personally I don't hear any difference between high-res and not-high-res, am content with 320 kb/s mp3, and use affordable AKG K702 headphones. I'd be interested to know what equipment you use - if you want "bitperfect" you surely have disabled all dsp effects, equalizers etc - what sound transducers do you use ? And do you hear a difference, let's say between upsampled and not upsampled ? )

I will try to write for the previous version but I don't think it will be a problem find it over the internet by myseft. I'm also suspicious about the last August Samsung security patch btw...Custom format makes no difference except switching to 192Khz content. Besides that everything came out as 48KHz sampling rate. Wel, I believe your software or hardware should not mess up with the original input too much. You are right I don't use any eq just what comes in comes out..Upsampling is pretty much placebo effect for me and what makes the true difference is the mastering. I have a ton of different masterings for the same album and it is fun to compare. Lossless or hi-res is just a nice packaging for well done mastering job. And for now I'm using S9+ directly from its line out 3,5mm jack with HD598Cs but my main rig is: Yggdrasil DAC with Jotunheim AMP along with HD650/HD660S, Focal Elex and Focal Clear is on my buy list, THX AAA 789 amp on the way in the next months so I'm pretty spoiled. I have never tried any of these with just my phone and neutron. It is pretty much an overkill. However, something like Chord Mojo with combination of the cans above could solve the problem. Neutron is pretty good with bitperfect streaming to external dac as I heard earlier.....Thanks again many times for your replies. very much appreciated.

EDIT
I just trying an older version v2.11.1 ARM64 and the real bummer is that it is working flawlessly!!! Neutron app is the problem here. Everything is working as it should. Sample rates are switching like crazy from 44.1 to 48, 96 192 or anything else. Frequencies shows all custom format selected sample rates from start to finish. I will go up the version numbers to find out where is the breaking point for me. Good news I guess! Audio Hardware is also showing the correct sample rates...I have to report it as bug.

blaubär
Posts: 403
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by blaubär » Fri Sep 06, 2019 8:24 am

semtexxl wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 6:46 am
I just trying an older version v2.11.1 ARM64 and the real bummer is that it is working flawlessly!!! Neutron app is the problem here. Everything is working as it should. Sample rates are switching like crazy from 44.1 to 48, 96 192 or anything else. Frequencies shows all custom format selected sample rates from start to finish. I will go up the version numbers to find out where is the breaking point for me. Good news I guess! Audio Hardware is also showing the correct sample rates...I have to report it as bug.
Yes, and the question is, has the bug come into Neutron with 2.12, or does 2.11 wrongly show fancy sampling rates ( and then does what ? ) ?
( I know that other music players had problems with Samsung / Pie to the effect that not all sampling rates could be chosen )

semtexxl
Posts: 7
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2019 11:49 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by semtexxl » Fri Sep 06, 2019 8:44 am

blaubär wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 8:24 am
Yes, and the question is, has the bug come into Neutron with 2.12, or does 2.11 wrongly show fancy sampling rates ( and then does what ? ) ?
( I know that other music players had problems with Samsung / Pie to the effect that not all sampling rates could be chosen )
Interesting point. However, all the previous versions of neutron were showing the same correct info? Even in advanced menu and all frequencies were listed correctly? And the noise when playing native DSD directly just proves it was sending the correct data. Now it suddenly can play DSD natively? I don't think so. Seems really strange to me. I'm switching back and fourth from 2.11.1 to 2.12 I also tried 2.09 with the same correct result. I will ask the developer here and try to report it as bug. I am interested about his thoughts with this problem.....

blaubär
Posts: 403
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by blaubär » Sat Sep 07, 2019 4:54 am

dmitrykos wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2014 7:22 pm
2.12.1:
* Hi-Res output for HDMI/SPDIF.
* Mono is applied before DSP and Balance.
! Fixed:
- Custom Format ignored (regression in 2.12.0);
- crash during scanning (regression in 2.12.0);
- USB DAC can not resume playback if interrupted by a phone/voice call.

varanasi.dh
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:36 pm

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by varanasi.dh » Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:46 pm

Hello! I have Meizu pro 6 plus with DAC ess sabre, neutron mp dont see him (dac), because in option audio hardware - generic driver there is no hi-res driver option, only custom format. :o :o :o

blaubär
Posts: 403
Joined: Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:48 am

Re: [TIP] Hi-Res Audio for Android devices

Post by blaubär » Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:17 am

varanasi.dh wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:46 pm
I have Meizu pro 6 plus with DAC ess sabre, neutron mp dont see him (dac), because in option audio hardware - generic driver there is no hi-res driver option, only custom format.
Did that ever work, e.g. with a previous version of Neutron or the operation system ?
Could you provide some screenshots of Settings > Audio Hardware ?

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